The Nvidia Defect Forum

Thank you so much for setting up this site, it has given me the confidence to try and obtain a refund/replacement for my laptop.

A bit of history...

I purchased an Acer Aspire 7720G with an Nvidia 8400M GS graphics card from Laptops Direct on 27 April 2008, I paid for a 'silver' Warranty which covered the laptop for 2 years, but typically the problems did not start until after the expiry of the warranty.

I use the laptop primarily for gaming, and have been experiencing poblems with maintaining a wireless connection, black screens (initially for a few seconds, but more recently resulting in the need to reboot completely), sometimes a completely black screen when booting up, and artefacts on screen when booting up (before windows kicks in). The graphics card has now stopped functioning completely, and is no longer recognised by the Device Manager. I have tried updating drivers for the graphics card - both from the Nvidia website directly, and from the Acer site), but this has not solved the problem.

A friend who is considerably more techy than me (!), has had a look and has pointed me in the direction of many discussions about the Nvidia defect and your forums.

I contacted Laptops direct using their emessaging system explaining the problems and stating that I was seeking a solution from them as the retailer, and received the rather stock response below:

"Please contact the Technical Support team for your items Manufacturer to arrange a collection and repair for your goods.

Dealing directly with the Manufacturer will mean you get their expert advice as well as speeding up repair as it removes the need for goods to be returned to us and then on to them.
Contact details can be found at http://www.laptopsdirect.co.uk/content/mfr_contacts.asp.

I have gathered from reading many of the posts on your forums, and your advice that I should not approach the manufacturer as it is not their responsibility to sort this out. Should I now send your 'Letter Before Action' to Laptops Direct straight away? or should I get something in writing from Acer to show that I have done what Laptops Direct have asked...?

Any advice will be very gratefully received. Thank you

Hello Marston and welcome to our forum.

Sorry to hear of the problems you are experiencing with your laptop.



You should completely disregard that piece of advice as it is entirely Laptops Direct responsibility to sort this out.

Furthermore, I do not recommend repairs as there are, in my opinion, no reliable parts available. This has been confirmed on numerous occasions by repeat failures even after a mainboard has been changed.

I would send the a letter before action and a template can be found here:- download/letter_before_action.doc

You should download that, edit it with your details and send it via recorded delivery to Laptops Direct.

If, after seven days you have not received a positive response then you will need to obtain an engineers report in order to prove the inherent defectiveness of your laptop.

There is a step by step guide available on this forum that will help you reach a positive resolution and that is here:- post13.html#p13

If you follow my advice in that guide then you will reach a positive resolution.

I would also like to add that you should also seek a refund of the silver warranty that you purchased as they cannot expect you to pay for a warranty on a laptop that is inherently defective.

If you have any questions or if you need any advice then please let me know.

Good luck and best wishes

Paul
The Admin Team

_________________
=======================================================
Calculate the minimum refund that you would be entitled to.
FAQ's
Why you should not accept a repair
Links to evidence
What is the Nvidia Defect?
Step by step help to getting a refund
Do you need an engineers report?
=======================================================

If you like what you see on this forum and would like to help then please post links to this forum in other forums or blogs. The more people we can help the better.


Please note that I am not legally qualified and I only offer my own personal advice. You are advised to seek professional legal advice for formal clarification of advice I give.

Hi Paul,

Thank you for your response to my original post.

I sent the first letter for action to Laptops Direct on 14 September (the recorded delivery was signed for); 14 days have now elapsed without a response from them. I will now arrange to send my laptop to you for an engineers report.

One more question, and I realise that this may be a bit of a guess!? I am struggling without a computer at home and would like buy a replacement as soon as possible.

If my laptop is proven to have this defect and of course assuming that I am successful in getting a resolution from Laptops Direct. As the laptop was over two years old when it failed I assume that I am more likely to get a part-refund of the purchase price from Laptops Direct than a replacement laptop - in your experience would this be be more likely to be a cash refund, or a store credit? I ask because I don't want to purchase a new machine only to be given a store credit that will be of no use! If I have purchased a replacement machine, could I then reject a store credit (if offered) and insist on a cash refund, not sure what my rights are here.

Many thanks once again for your help,

Rachel

Hello Rachel,



In the past customers have received a mixture of refunds or replacement laptops so it is difficult to be able to state what they will offer you.

You can refuse a store credit on the basis that you have already purchased a replacement and so a credit is of no use to you.

I hope the above helps.

Please let me know if you have any questions.

Best wishes

Paul
The Admin Team

_________________
=======================================================
Calculate the minimum refund that you would be entitled to.
FAQ's
Why you should not accept a repair
Links to evidence
What is the Nvidia Defect?
Step by step help to getting a refund
Do you need an engineers report?
=======================================================

If you like what you see on this forum and would like to help then please post links to this forum in other forums or blogs. The more people we can help the better.


Please note that I am not legally qualified and I only offer my own personal advice. You are advised to seek professional legal advice for formal clarification of advice I give.

Hi Paul,

Think we're going to hang fire for a bit on a new purchase...

I have added a job on the Lapcure Website (RMA # 10504)

Is it possible for the laptop to be picked up from my Husband's work address as I will not be at home, and my office is a vast warren of corridors and is always a nightmare for couriers! Also please could any documentation and the report be issued in his name as he was the named purchaser of the laptop and will be the one named on the Small court filing should this get that far!

I will PM you the address details and name details.

Many thanks,

Rachel

Hello Rachel,



Thank you for that Rachel, I have now sent you an email with more details.



No problems whatsoever with that, we don't want to get the couriers too confused with corridors

If you have any questions or need any advice along the way then please let me know.

Best wishes

Paul
The Admin Team

_________________
=======================================================
Calculate the minimum refund that you would be entitled to.
FAQ's
Why you should not accept a repair
Links to evidence
What is the Nvidia Defect?
Step by step help to getting a refund
Do you need an engineers report?
=======================================================

If you like what you see on this forum and would like to help then please post links to this forum in other forums or blogs. The more people we can help the better.


Please note that I am not legally qualified and I only offer my own personal advice. You are advised to seek professional legal advice for formal clarification of advice I give.

Hi, apologies for a long delay in updating my case, have still not reached a resolution, but here's an update... this may be a bit of a long post!!

We sent our initial letter to Laptops Direct on 14 September 2010. Having had no response for three weeks after this letter, I obtained an excellent engineers report from Paul (thank you once again for that) this confirmed that the Nvidia defect is present in our laptop. A couple of days after the laptop and reports were returned to us we received a letter from buyitdirect.co.uk dated a full month from the date of our letter.

"14 October 2010

In response to your letter dated 15 September 2010.

I'm sorry to hear you are having problems with your laptop.

Under the Sales of Goods Act 1979, it states that the goods 'should last for a reasonable amount of time' but this does not mean that they will always remain fault free for entirety of the 6 years covered by the Act. As with all electrical items, problems may arise often due to general wear and tear, unfortunately in these cases we are not liable for the repair costs. We do always recommend that our customers purchase an extended warranty with their purchase so that there is cover in case of problems like this.

If you feel that your laptop has had the fault from time of purchase, we recommend that you seek an independent engineers report from an approved repair centre. The report will need to state that the problem is due to an inherent fault would have been present at the time of manufacture. If you can supply a report of this nature we will happily look into the problem further for you.

I'm sorry we cannot be of any further assistance with the matter at this stage"

It took us a couple of weeks I'm afraid, but I finally sent a 'Letter before Action' on the 27 October, enclosing the sales invoice details, Lapcure Engineers' Report, Lapcure invoice. We are requesting a refund of the cost of the laptop (plus the cost of the two year extended warranty) not a replacement as we have already had to purchase a replacement machine as we needed computer access from home. I stated that I needed a response in 7 days or I would issue a small claims procedure.

We received a response from buyitdirect.co.uk today...

"4 November 2010

In response to the details in your letter, we have been attempting to find a suitable solution to the problem with your laptop. We are requesting to collect the laptop from you to be received by us for the issue to be verified and a costing confirmed by our engineers.

At the moment we are unable to confirm a full outcome to the investigation as this will be determined once the goods have been inspected by our engineers.

If you can contact our Customer Service Team on 0871 7502970 at your earliest convenience, they will arrange to collect the faulty machine and return it to our warehouse"

I am a bit confused over what the next step should be. I assumed that the independent engineers report would be sufficient to prove that our laptop has the defect. They requested that we get this report in their first letter and it states all the facts that they asked for. Why do their engineers also need to inspect the laptop? is this usual practice in these cases?
I know that we need to show that we have been reasonable in our actions for a small claims court case should it come to it, would not sending them the laptop be seen as being unreasonable?

What would you advise as the next step?

Many thanks once again.

Hello Marston,

Retailers do have the right to inspect a laptop post engineers report in order to confirm the details in the report.



A costing for what? A repair?

The GPU in your laptop is on a removable card which means that your laptop will not need replacing, they just need to be able to provide a non-infected card.

I would contact them and would tell them that their email is ambiguous and that you need some clarification as to what they intend to do.

I would further tell them that as per their request you have now obtained and provided a copy of your engineers report. I would ask if they are intending undertaking a repair on your laptop and if so you will require a written guarantee and the part number of the card that they intend to use.

Try the above then pop back here and let me know and I will advise further.

Good luck and best wishes

Paul
The Admin Team

_________________
=======================================================
Calculate the minimum refund that you would be entitled to.
FAQ's
Why you should not accept a repair
Links to evidence
What is the Nvidia Defect?
Step by step help to getting a refund
Do you need an engineers report?
=======================================================

If you like what you see on this forum and would like to help then please post links to this forum in other forums or blogs. The more people we can help the better.


Please note that I am not legally qualified and I only offer my own personal advice. You are advised to seek professional legal advice for formal clarification of advice I give.

Hi Paul,

Another few months have passed and we still have not reached a resolution.

We finally sent the laptop off to buy it direct for them to inspect it, and have today - after a number of weeks - had the following response.

"Thank you for the return of your goods.

We have been in contact with Acer who manufactured your laptop, they have indeed confirmed the unit was supplied with the Nvidea defect as per your engineers report. In order to resolve this matter they have agreed to take the unit back for a repair to be made, this repair would involve a new motherboard being fitted to the machine.

As a gesture of good will Buy it Direct would also agree to reimburse the cost of your engineers report if a receipt could be provided.

Can you please advise how you would like to proceed so the repair can take place and the unit returned as soon as possible."

Should we accept this offer of a repair?

I am a bit confused (again!). In the engineers report that you provided (Job ID# 467 (RMA: 10504)) you stated that you did not think repair was a viable option, but this is what Acer & Buyitdirect are proposing. Are viable (defect free) parts now available? We obviously don't want to accept a repair only for the laptop to fail prematurely again at a future date. We also are anxious that the parts used in any repair are of a reasonable standard/spec, we do not want to end up with a 'down-graded' machine.

Thank you once again for your help.

Hello Marston,

I am not convinced that there are brand new spare parts, containing the 8400 GPU that will be free from the defect.

It is excellent news that Acer have admitted to the Nvidia defect in your model of laptop as I don't think that they have done that publicly before.

If Buy IT Direct want to offer a repair then they should provide a written guarantee, on their headed notepaper, that states the following:-



If they refuse to provide you with the above guarantee then you should refuse their offer of a repair on the basis that they haven't provided any evidence that the repair will be of a satisfactory quality.

I would further tell them that you will only accept either a replacement laptop or a refund.

If they are prepared to offer the written guarantee then that means that they have confidence in the repair being offered and so you would have to accept the repair, though you would be in a very strong position should anything go wrong again.

What do you think?

Best wishes

Paul
The Admin Team

_________________
=======================================================
Calculate the minimum refund that you would be entitled to.
FAQ's
Why you should not accept a repair
Links to evidence
What is the Nvidia Defect?
Step by step help to getting a refund
Do you need an engineers report?
=======================================================

If you like what you see on this forum and would like to help then please post links to this forum in other forums or blogs. The more people we can help the better.


Please note that I am not legally qualified and I only offer my own personal advice. You are advised to seek professional legal advice for formal clarification of advice I give.